Discussion:
Communists lose 1946 Czechoslovak election
(too old to reply)
David Tenner
2017-10-15 17:00:12 UTC
Permalink
The 1946 Czecholoslovak elections
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czechoslovak_parliamentary_election,_1946 were
conducted *after* the Soviets had withdrawn their trooops, and IMO have to be
considered basically free elections despite the banning of some pre-war
right-wing parties like the Agrarians and the disqualification of some voters
for collaboration with the Germans. [1] (There was certainly nothing like the
violence and falsification of returns that characterized the 1947 Polish
elections.) Anyway, let's say that for some reason, Benes' National Socialist
Party (no relation to the Nazis, of course, despite the similarity of
names...) does considerably better and the Communists considerably worse in
the election than in OTL. (Even in OTL the Marxist parties--the Communists
and the Social Democrats who, under Fierlinger's
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zdenek_Fierlinger leadership, were their close
allies--only got a bare majority in the National Assembly.) The non-Marxist
parties are still willing to have a coalition government with the Communists
but insist that the Communists *not* get the key positions of Prime Minister
or Minister of the Interior or Minister of Defense. (Ludvik Svoboda, who held
the last-named position, was not technically a Communist but was strongly
aligned with them.) If the Communists insist "give us these positions or we
won't participate in the government at all"--well, then, the National
Socialists, the People's (Catholic) Party, and the Slovak Democrats say they
will if necesssary form a governmemt all by themselves. (And they might be
joined by some Social Democrats; not everyone in the party was happy with
Fierlinger's leadership.)

What does Stalin do? Does he send troops back in, regardless of any backlash
this may cause in the West? I get the impression that in 1946 he is not yet
ready for a total break with the Western Allies--the Communists are still in
the governments of France and Italy, the Marshall Plan and Truman Doctrine
have yet to be formulated, etc. But if he doesn't send troops back in, will
Czechoslovakia still eventually become a Communist state? (The Czechoslovak
Communists, even without the control of key ministries or the aid of Soviet
troops, still do have leverage--with their control of the trade unions, they
can call strikes, including a general strike. But strikes alone were not
enough to destablilize France or Italy in 1947 after the Communists left the
government.) Can Stalin reconcile himself to a "Finlandized" (for want of a
better word) Czechoslovakia?

It is tempting to argue that a victory of the non-Communists would in the end
mean no more than the victory of the Smallholders in Hungary in 1945.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungarian_parliamentary_election,_1945 But
again remember that what made it possible for Rakosi's "salami tactics"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mátyás_Rákosi to work in Hungary was the
presence of the Red Army.

[1] One indication that the election results were not foreordaianed is that
in Slovakia, the Slovak Democratic Party got 62 percent of the vote, compared
to only 30.3 percent for the Slovak Communists.
https://books.google.com/books?id=AZZoTdLB4nwC&pg=PA174 Yet the election was
neither more nor less free in the Czech lands than in Slovakia. If Czech
voters had been as supportive of the non-Marxist parties as their Slovak
counterparts were, there would have been a clear non-Marxist majority in the
National Assembly.
--
David Tenner
***@ameritech.net
Yeechang Lee
2017-10-16 05:49:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Tenner
What does Stalin do? Does he send troops back in, regardless of any
backlash this may cause in the West? I get the impression that in
1946 he is not yet ready for a total break with the Western
Allies--the Communists are still in the governments of France and
Italy, the Marshall Plan and Truman Doctrine have yet to be
formulated, etc.
Yes, but an election a year after V-E day is arguably still close
enough to Yalta for Stalin to get away with it.
Post by David Tenner
Can Stalin reconcile himself to a "Finlandized" (for want of a
better word) Czechoslovakia?
Finland was merely Finlandized because the Finnish had held off the
Soviets during the war. Austria escaped division because Stalin did
not view it as important enough as Germany to fight with the West over
the long term (and it still took a decade for the Soviets to
leave). Czechoslovakia was not enormously important, but it was still
within the Soviet sphere of influence in a way that Austria or Finland
was not.

The Hungarian example is (as you say) not an exact fit but still the
most likely outcome for the Czechs. It would be easier for Stalin to
send in troops in mid-1946—when the US is focused on the housing
shortage, the UK is dealing with increased rationing, and the
Anglo-American alliance has not yet been renewed—than in 1948, the
year of the Marshall Plan and Berlin Blockade.
--
geo:37.783333,-122.416667
David Tenner
2017-10-20 22:02:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Yeechang Lee
Post by David Tenner
What does Stalin do? Does he send troops back in, regardless of any
backlash this may cause in the West? I get the impression that in
1946 he is not yet ready for a total break with the Western
Allies--the Communists are still in the governments of France and
Italy, the Marshall Plan and Truman Doctrine have yet to be
formulated, etc.
Yes, but an election a year after V-E day is arguably still close
enough to Yalta for Stalin to get away with it.
Post by David Tenner
Can Stalin reconcile himself to a "Finlandized" (for want of a
better word) Czechoslovakia?
Finland was merely Finlandized because the Finnish had held off the
Soviets during the war. Austria escaped division because Stalin did
not view it as important enough as Germany to fight with the West over
the long term (and it still took a decade for the Soviets to
leave). Czechoslovakia was not enormously important, but it was still
within the Soviet sphere of influence in a way that Austria or Finland
was not.
The Hungarian example is (as you say) not an exact fit but still the
most likely outcome for the Czechs. It would be easier for Stalin to
send in troops in mid-1946—when the US is focused on the housing
shortage, the UK is dealing with increased rationing, and the
Anglo-American alliance has not yet been renewed—than in 1948, the
year of the Marshall Plan and Berlin Blockade.
FWIW, Stalin also withdrew from Iran in 1946...
--
David Tenner
***@ameritech.net
Rich Rostrom
2017-10-21 01:40:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Tenner
FWIW, Stalin also withdrew from Iran in 1946...
True - OTOH, the Soviet "zone" in Iran did
not include the capital, and was not almost
surrounded by other Soviet controlled territory.
--
Nous sommes dans une pot de chambre, et nous y serons emmerdés.
--- General Auguste-Alexandre Ducrot at Sedan, 1870.
WolfBear
2018-03-10 19:55:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Tenner
The 1946 Czecholoslovak elections
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czechoslovak_parliamentary_election,_1946 were
conducted *after* the Soviets had withdrawn their trooops, and IMO have to be
considered basically free elections despite the banning of some pre-war
right-wing parties like the Agrarians and the disqualification of some voters
for collaboration with the Germans. [1] (There was certainly nothing like the
violence and falsification of returns that characterized the 1947 Polish
elections.) Anyway, let's say that for some reason, Benes' National Socialist
Party (no relation to the Nazis, of course, despite the similarity of
names...) does considerably better and the Communists considerably worse in
the election than in OTL. (Even in OTL the Marxist parties--the Communists
and the Social Democrats who, under Fierlinger's
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zdenek_Fierlinger leadership, were their close
allies--only got a bare majority in the National Assembly.) The non-Marxist
parties are still willing to have a coalition government with the Communists
but insist that the Communists *not* get the key positions of Prime Minister
or Minister of the Interior or Minister of Defense. (Ludvik Svoboda, who held
the last-named position, was not technically a Communist but was strongly
aligned with them.) If the Communists insist "give us these positions or we
won't participate in the government at all"--well, then, the National
Socialists, the People's (Catholic) Party, and the Slovak Democrats say they
will if necesssary form a governmemt all by themselves. (And they might be
joined by some Social Democrats; not everyone in the party was happy with
Fierlinger's leadership.)
What does Stalin do? Does he send troops back in, regardless of any backlash
this may cause in the West? I get the impression that in 1946 he is not yet
ready for a total break with the Western Allies--the Communists are still in
the governments of France and Italy, the Marshall Plan and Truman Doctrine
have yet to be formulated, etc. But if he doesn't send troops back in, will
Czechoslovakia still eventually become a Communist state? (The Czechoslovak
Communists, even without the control of key ministries or the aid of Soviet
troops, still do have leverage--with their control of the trade unions, they
can call strikes, including a general strike. But strikes alone were not
enough to destablilize France or Italy in 1947 after the Communists left the
government.) Can Stalin reconcile himself to a "Finlandized" (for want of a
better word) Czechoslovakia?
It is tempting to argue that a victory of the non-Communists would in the end
mean no more than the victory of the Smallholders in Hungary in 1945.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungarian_parliamentary_election,_1945 But
again remember that what made it possible for Rakosi's "salami tactics"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mátyás_Rákosi to work in Hungary was the
presence of the Red Army.
[1] One indication that the election results were not foreordaianed is that
in Slovakia, the Slovak Democratic Party got 62 percent of the vote, compared
to only 30.3 percent for the Slovak Communists.
https://books.google.com/books?id=AZZoTdLB4nwC&pg=PA174 Yet the election was
neither more nor less free in the Czech lands than in Slovakia. If Czech
voters had been as supportive of the non-Marxist parties as their Slovak
counterparts were, there would have been a clear non-Marxist majority in the
National Assembly.
--
David Tenner
If the Communists and the Social Democrats combined will have slightly less than a majority in the Czechoslovak Parliament in 1946, the odds of a Communist coup in Czechoslovakia would have still been the same since the Communists controlled the security services, the trade unions, et cetera, correct?

Also, one important but underlooked factor here is that if Czechoslovakia manages to avoid Communist rule and remains neutral, then it or its constituent parts (Czechia and Slovakia, if Czechoslovakia will still break up) will probably remain neutral after the end of the Cold War just like Finland did. In turn, what this would mean is that logistics are going to be much more problematic for NATO since there would be a large neutral zone consisting of Switzerland, Austria, Czechoslovakia, and Ukraine which would almost split the NATO bloc in two. Indeed, if one will want to move troops, weapons, or supplies from NATO member Poland to NATO member Hungary, one would have to go through Germany, France, Italy, and Slovenia.
David Tenner
2018-03-11 05:52:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by WolfBear
If the Communists and the Social Democrats combined will have slightly
less than a majority in the Czechoslovak Parliament in 1946, the odds of
a Communist coup in Czechoslovakia would have still been the same since
the Communists controlled the security services, the trade unions, et
cetera, correct?
The idea of the post is that the non-Marxist parties, doing better than their
OTL showing in the 1946 election, do not feel obliged to offer the Communists
the Ministry of the Interior--so the Communists do not gain dominance over
the security forces. In this scenario Benes et al are willing to offer some
cabinet seats to the Communists, but the coalition looks more those of 1945-7
in France and Italy--Communists participate but do not dominate.
--
David Tenner
***@ameritech.net
WolfBear
2018-03-11 06:16:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Tenner
Post by WolfBear
If the Communists and the Social Democrats combined will have slightly
less than a majority in the Czechoslovak Parliament in 1946, the odds of
a Communist coup in Czechoslovakia would have still been the same since
the Communists controlled the security services, the trade unions, et
cetera, correct?
The idea of the post is that the non-Marxist parties, doing better than their
OTL showing in the 1946 election, do not feel obliged to offer the Communists
the Ministry of the Interior--so the Communists do not gain dominance over
the security forces. In this scenario Benes et al are willing to offer some
cabinet seats to the Communists, but the coalition looks more those of 1945-7
in France and Italy--Communists participate but do not dominate.
--
David Tenner
OK; understood. Indeed, this certainly makes sense.

That said, though, to clarify--the Communists and Social Democrats need to do *significantly* worse in these elections (rather than only *slightly* worse) in order to be denied the Ministry of the Interior, correct?
t***@gmail.com
2018-03-17 13:20:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Tenner
The 1946 Czecholoslovak elections
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czechoslovak_parliamentary_election,_1946 were
conducted *after* the Soviets had withdrawn their trooops, and IMO have to be
considered basically free elections despite the banning of some pre-war
right-wing parties like the Agrarians and the disqualification of some voters
for collaboration with the Germans. [1] (There was certainly nothing like the
violence and falsification of returns that characterized the 1947 Polish
elections.) Anyway, let's say that for some reason, Benes' National Socialist
Party (no relation to the Nazis, of course, despite the similarity of
names...) does considerably better and the Communists considerably worse in
the election than in OTL. (Even in OTL the Marxist parties--the Communists
and the Social Democrats who, under Fierlinger's
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zdenek_Fierlinger leadership, were their close
allies--only got a bare majority in the National Assembly.) The non-Marxist
parties are still willing to have a coalition government with the Communists
but insist that the Communists *not* get the key positions of Prime Minister
or Minister of the Interior or Minister of Defense. (Ludvik Svoboda, who held
the last-named position, was not technically a Communist but was strongly
aligned with them.) If the Communists insist "give us these positions or we
won't participate in the government at all"--well, then, the National
Socialists, the People's (Catholic) Party, and the Slovak Democrats say they
will if necesssary form a governmemt all by themselves. (And they might be
joined by some Social Democrats; not everyone in the party was happy with
Fierlinger's leadership.)
What does Stalin do? Does he send troops back in, regardless of any backlash
this may cause in the West? I get the impression that in 1946 he is not yet
ready for a total break with the Western Allies--the Communists are still in
the governments of France and Italy, the Marshall Plan and Truman Doctrine
have yet to be formulated, etc. But if he doesn't send troops back in, will
Czechoslovakia still eventually become a Communist state? (The Czechoslovak
Communists, even without the control of key ministries or the aid of Soviet
troops, still do have leverage--with their control of the trade unions, they
can call strikes, including a general strike. But strikes alone were not
enough to destablilize France or Italy in 1947 after the Communists left the
government.) Can Stalin reconcile himself to a "Finlandized" (for want of a
better word) Czechoslovakia?
It is tempting to argue that a victory of the non-Communists would in the end
mean no more than the victory of the Smallholders in Hungary in 1945.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungarian_parliamentary_election,_1945 But
again remember that what made it possible for Rakosi's "salami tactics"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mátyás_Rákosi to work in Hungary was the
presence of the Red Army.
[1] One indication that the election results were not foreordaianed is that
in Slovakia, the Slovak Democratic Party got 62 percent of the vote, compared
to only 30.3 percent for the Slovak Communists.
https://books.google.com/books?id=AZZoTdLB4nwC&pg=PA174 Yet the election was
neither more nor less free in the Czech lands than in Slovakia. If Czech
voters had been as supportive of the non-Marxist parties as their Slovak
counterparts were, there would have been a clear non-Marxist majority in the
National Assembly.
--
David Tenner
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