Discussion:
The Russian SFSR Annexes the Ukrainian and Byelorussian SSRs
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WolfBear
2017-04-13 01:56:16 UTC
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What if the Bolsheviks--either under Lenin or in the early Stalin years--would have had the Russian SFSR annex both the Ukrainian and the Byelorussian SSR? Basically, the reason for this is that the Bolsheviks would have come to the conclusion that the East Slavic proletariat need to be put into one country and become one people so that they can devote their exclusive focus and attention to fighting predatory bourgeois imperialism.

Also, if the Soviet Union still eventually annexes Galicia in this TL, Galicia also gets annexed to the Russian SFSR right afterwards.

Anyway, what about the consequences of this be? Would the Bolsheviks have succeeded in Russifying Belarus and most of Ukraine like they did with the Kuban? Or would the Bolsheviks' move here only result in the weakening of the Russian SFSR due to its annexation of many non-Russians and its inability to assimilate them?

Also, how exactly would this affect the breakup of the Soviet Union several decades later?

Any thoughts on all of this?
Dan
2017-04-14 14:50:43 UTC
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It wouldn't make the slightest difference till 1991 as under the Soviet Union is the Soviet Union.

Post break up of Soviet Union, would there be nationalist sentiment wanting to break away from the Rebublic, in OTL the 15 Republics saw relatively Lille violence in the breakaway, there were deaths in both Georgia and the Baltics, but when Chechnya tried to breakaway from the republic, no quarter was given and there was mass slaughter.
WolfBear
2017-05-11 23:24:51 UTC
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Post by Dan
It wouldn't make the slightest difference till 1991 as under the Soviet Union is the Soviet Union.
Post break up of Soviet Union, would there be nationalist sentiment wanting to break away from the Rebublic, in OTL the 15 Republics saw relatively Lille violence in the breakaway, there were deaths in both Georgia and the Baltics, but when Chechnya tried to breakaway from the republic, no quarter was given and there was mass slaughter.
So, would we see a mass slaughter in western Ukraine--especially in Galicia--after the end of the Cold War in this TL?

Or would cooler heads prevail--with Galicia being given a very large amount of autonomy inside of Russia in this TL?
j***@mdfs.net
2017-06-18 03:25:34 UTC
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This was Stalin's original plan - absorb Ukraine and Byelorussia
into Russia. It was Lenin who insisted they "build another storey"
and build the USSR out of the constituent republics. If Stalin's
method had gnoe ahead that would have laid the ground for how the
rest of the OTL Soviet republics have been gathered into a single
state - a single Russia, not a 15-member USSR.

And Russia isn't a monolithic state, it (and all the other Soviet
republics) are/were subdivided into autonomous republics, oblasts,
regions, etc. The result in 1991 would be instead of the USSR
fracturing into 15 pre-existing entities, it would frracture into
30, 40, 50+ pre-existing entities, with probably fighing to try
and keep some bits together against people who didn't want to be
kept together.
Rich Rostrom
2017-06-18 18:22:42 UTC
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Post by j***@mdfs.net
And Russia isn't a monolithic state, it (and all the other Soviet
republics) are/were subdivided into autonomous republics, oblasts,
regions, etc. The result in 1991 would be instead of the USSR
fracturing into 15 pre-existing entities, it would frracture into
30, 40, 50+ pre-existing entities, with probably fighing to try
and keep some bits together against people who didn't want to be
kept together.
Possibly. But the nominally federal structure of the
USSR, and IIRC the explicit authorization of secession
in the Soviet constitution, pretty much guaranteed that
the Soviet state would fragment when the Communist
regime fell.

If Stalin had had his way, there would be many more
first-level subdivisions of the "Soviet Republic of
Russia", with much less authority.

It's possible that there would be regional secession
movements, but ISTM much less likely.
--
The real Velvet Revolution - and the would-be hijacker.

http://originalvelvetrevolution.com
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